Adobe Creative Cloud and the Death of Boxed Software | Page 3 | News | Forum
"I wouldn’t mind 10 bucks a month for PS alone and 10 bucks for each additional suite and use a pay as you go subscription for those of us who use it on an occasional basis.. wouldn’t that be more fair? right guys?"
That's exactly the number I have been thinking about as a more fair price for PhotoShop by itself. I didn't want to throw it out there, but was waiting to see if someone would chime in with other price points that would work for them.
Even the URL has the word cfusion in it. What's not cfusing is the rip-off price in the UK. £70 a month for month to month membership. That's 107 dollars a month. Something very wrong there. I used to work for a games company producing a very popular MMO. They learned the hard way what happens when you piss off your customers where pricing is concerned. There were some pretty rapid U-turns, red faces., and a few rolling heads.
Very good points Tim L.
I actually keep a separate (perpetual) license for Lightroom, which is where the vast majority of my images reside. And, I'll likely continue to do so as long as it is offered. The installation restrictions make a lot more sense for the way I use Lightroom – multiple home computers and a travel computer, which is something I couldn't do on Creative Cloud's version of Lightroom.
Of course, if I dropped CC, I would have to roll back to CS5.5 (or upgrade to CS6) and likely lose some compatibility with current projects that would be created on CC products. This isn't something any of us really considered a week ago (even though we expected it would come someday, just not so soon), which is why I hope that some of this negative feedback from users pushes Adobe to change the structure of Creative Cloud a bit – with the perpetual licenses I suggested as a big one on my wish list.
If the noise is loud enough and the money is not making sense for Adobe, I think we'll see some things change. But those are some big "ifs".
Again, you make some very good points. Thanks for chiming in this conversation.
The biggest beneficiary of Apple's mistake in 2011 when they introduced FCP X was adobe. If you didn't use Adobe then, you certainly did when Apple made their arrogant move.
Last year when the subscription was announced, I debated purchasing the upgrade to CS6, or doing the subscription. They KEY REASON I switched to the subscription was the promise that subscription based customers would get upgrades sooner.
In the 12 months I have been a subscriber, I cannot think of a single upgrade that was given to subscribers. Adobe will tell you they put Lightroom into the package. Big deal. I owned it already. A year ago, the showed the same new features they are showing now. Namely the antishake filter and the line straightening filter. In 12 months, they are still just promises.
I purchased the upgrade from 5.5 to CS6 yesterday. I cancelled my subscription. This means I spent $$700 on CS 6 if you combine the 11 months at $30, and the $375.00 one time purchase.
I'm already exploring other software packages like Corel and Avid. If my extensive collection of plug ins work, I suspect in about a year or two, I'll move. I'll most likely move to Avid for video editing after I complete my current project in Adobe Premiere.
Over the 20 years I have used adobe products, I have spent tens of thousands of $ with Adobe, That ended yesterday.
This is a company who have sent their coding and customer service off shore. They are clearly working only for investors and shareholders. They have forgotten their customer base. This is not an uncommon phenomenon, but I have yet to see a company succeed long term forgetting to dance with the girl they brought to the dance.
Thanks for your kind reply regarding my comment. I have been a user/buyer of Adobe products since 1990-9. I got my first copy of Photoshop in 1991 Ver-1. I work in the print industry and done many different things through out the years. I was a master four color stripper back in 1982 and have progressed with the technology from film on tables to computers as big as a large rooms. We would run what I called ticker tape reals that would be translated by the computers and set type in galley format that would be pasted onto boards to be shot to film. When desktop publishing came to the industry and started to be implemented in the early 90's I was there. I went from wet etching film to dry etching film to doing color corrections on the Scitex systems to personal computing editing of 4C scans to today where I run CTP systems and all work is done on computers. I have seen it all. I have been a loyal customer of Adobe products. They make fantastic products. What rubs me the wrong way about this is they take away yours and mine the option of hard box, digital download or the Creative Cloud that you address in you article. Its now a take it or leave it product. It really is about generating more money for Adobe than anything else. They / you can bring up all kind of points that make it sound like a good thing but really Adobe has decided for you. You / me, we just need to shut up and pull out our wallets and pay up. I just don't see this as a good thing, any way you slice it. That creative cloud thing where are your files?? Are they in cyber space somewhere?? Who else can access your copyright protected file without your permission? You cant say that no one else can get to them because you didn't create to cloud. It is possible for you stuff/files to be stollen. I don't know to many questions and right now not enough good answers for them. I hate this we will figure it out as we go along mentality that seems to permeate the industry. I guess we will see how all this pans out over the next couple of years.
I just looked at my bookcase. I have Adobe books and software back of CS2, Lightroom from inception. Adobe has climbed to the top of the heap on all our backs with our bucks. They haven't said much about Lightroom except that LR5 will still be perpetual software. Their onerous policy can only be a short way off for Lightroom as well.
Lightroom's workflow serves most of my needs, but I don't want to continue to commit to Lightroom if suddenly we become faced with a similar marketing scheme. And as I enter my golden years with a smaller pocketbook to boot, I'll welcome suggestions for a direction to move other than with Adobe products.
This is bull crap I have owned photoshop since the beginning and I love it and upgrade every time they have a new Ver, but this is totally unacceptable to obligate everybody to keep paying or else, no more PS specially to people that makes no money from Photography and all we do is spend more, new cameras, new gadgets, new learning curves and we are the ones that get punished for it.
Every day it seams we have to fight people from getting their hand in our pockets.
I have used PS since v2.5. I have sunk a lot of money into Adobe though the years. I will only purchase LR from now on…until they make it subscription only. I will use the version that I have right now till hell freezes or or I die…whichever comes first (any guesses? ; )…. I am 66 and about to retire. There is no room in the budget for CC. They won't fold without me but perhaps me and many many others will put a dent in their income. Whatever!! Good luck to them.
Lots of other concerns about the *TERMS* of the CC lease:
I too, am hitting the 72 mark this year, so I understand what you guys are saying. My income is Social Security and a part-time job in retail. Photography is not where I earn my money – it is where I spend some of my excess cash. With expenses in all areas on the rise, I felt that I would probably just stay with CS6. Now Adobe has made my mind up for me. No Creative Cloud. CS6 and Elements forever!
I just changed camera systems and as long as what I have in software will work with my RAW files, I am all set. If I have to get new cameras in the future, I will just shoot JPEG as some of the members in my camera club do.
I think Adobe is missing the point. CC might be fine for big companies and pro photographers who can write off the "rental" fees, but hobbyists cannot do that. Adobe needs to increase the capabilities of Elements and call it Photoshop Lite. They could raise the price to, say $125-$150 and have a 18 month upgrade cycle at $50.00. I would go for that before I would rent CC.
I agree with a couple of the posters here: what Adobe has done is chosen to focus on the professional community, who can more-readily incorporate a 'lease' model into their business operations than a large periodic investment – and effectively to leave the semi-pro and avid amateur market to competitors. It's an interesting decision, especially these days as dSLR cameras have entered the mainstream – I guess they hope Elements and Lightroom will hold the fort – and they may.
But whereas there's really been a dearth of viable alternatives (open-source and commercial) in the face of a very impressive product suite… now maybe there's room, once more, for someone wanting to offer a viable alternative.
I *can* pay the $20/mo – even the $50/mo – but I won't. Mind you, for me it's an easy decision: I upgraded from CS2 to CS6 last year because of the 'move or die' license ultimatum Adobe offered at that time. CS6 has way more functionality than I can handle these days – practically speaking Elements is probably more what I can handle, but I like some of the flexibility that you'd have to game Elements to achieve. But unless/until the bits rot and fall off, CS6 should last me for a while.
Guess that we are going backward to "old fashioned" period by hand drawing to save our works than saving in the cloud where there is no back up. The chance that once you don't use adobe cloud, they steal your work! Taking digital camera and be creative without using photoshop is like going back to film photographer where we had to challenge it. Using our hand works and scan them up to save our works. I think adobe is going to lose us as customer big time. I don't get why adobe have hard time trust us with priacy issues. Why did they provided us a key USB with a serial number that protect their software instead of copying off the software in the first place? Archicad is smart to do that when they used key USB. So adobe should have done that. I complete disagreed with adobe cloud and it makes me keep my old adobe software and using my old window as long as I can because I hate window surface or newer version as well. This is such a disappointment and we need to encourage young people to not use those subscription because it is a huge wasting of money. We are in a debt country!
Thanks for the follow-up Ed.
That's a fascinating viewpoint from someone who has been a part of the creative industry as long as you have. I appreciate where you are coming from and all that you have seen in the industry. I was four in 1982 (when you were a master four color stripper), so you definitely have a different perspective on this industry than I do. While I used film in high-school and college, I am primarily a product of the digital age. So, we are certainly coming from different places.
I'll look forward to your voice in this conversation as the Creative Cloud and whatever changes follow in the coming months and years (be it competition, roll-backs to boxed software from Adobe, or whatever else may happen).
I want all the features in Camera Raw to be available in Elements as I do a lot of adjustments in ACR before opening in Photoshop or Elements. I use ACR with JPEG files as well as RAW files.
I don't like the organizer in Elements and prefer Bridge for organization of images. I do not have Elements 11; I still use 10. I upgrade Elements every 2-3 years. Two members of my camera club teach PS and PSE and that is their recommendation. When PSE 12 comes out this fall I will get it and reserve any future comments on the differences between PS and PSE at that time.
I use PSE for some of the features that are not in PS. I don't use plug-ins and I don't care for the HDR Grunge look that so many of my club members use in their competition images.
Take a look an this guys web site. Lloyd Chambers blog I have followed him for many years. Here is his take on the Adobe service/user agreement. Now this is scary. How about all of those images that are in the CC, that you created, that are a source of income, a part of your soul are frozen and you now have been shut out/cut off. You would not be a happy camper. How about Adobe have the right to use your content any way they want. Make money off of you but dont have to pay you for that. Scary Scary Scary. I dont even buy into Apples version of the cloud. I dont want anyone to be able to access my content without me being in complete control.
Eric your article has turned into a great community conversation. If I had written an article like you did and had this kind of community conversation going on I would be very proud. Good job dude and keep up the good work.
On another note I was on the advisory board for one of the tech schools here in Pennsylvania. Dealing with the graphic arts and I completely understand where you're coming from. Most of the students had no idea what the fundamental foundations in the industry were and where they came from. It's a fascinating time to be part of right now things are moving at the speed of light but we still need to be careful and thoughtful about what takes place.
Have a great day
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